The new Bangkok Hospital in Hua Hin

[dozer]

The Bangkok hospital is no different from any other private hospital worldwide; their primary function is to make money.
That being said they in my experience do provide first class treatment, but they have absolutely no qualms about sticking to their business orientated policies with no consideration to individual financial circumstances.

[ian lawrie]

Dr Mike.

I am well over 60 and I am looking for health insurance that can be used at your hospital I have been recommended April and Muang Thai the second one concerns. Do you have any information on these companies or is there one you can recommend. Thank you

[Big Boy]

MEDICAL CARE & TRAVEL:
A situation occurs quite frequently and can lead to missunderstandings and problems with Medical Insurance companies.
A patient has care in the hospital,after 3 or 4 days we are quite happy for the patient to leave the hospital and have a quiet time in HH, but are not happy in them taking an 18 hour journey back to their own country.
If they are leaving to continue to recover in their condo or house all is usually well, but if they are staying in a hotel problems can arise. The med Ins company will almost never pay for the hotel room and yet will not consent to them staying in hospital so the patient has to pay for the hotel room themselves.

Dr Mike, this reads a bit like the pot calling the kettle black to me. In my poor wife's case, Bangkok Hospital, Hua Hin were not prepared to wait for my insurance company's agent, who had been working with Bangkok Hospital, Hua Hin for a couple of days to pay up. I was told that I had to pay the bill immediately, or incur a further 7,000 Baht per day hotel fees while I you waited.

While I have no problem with my wife's treatment - in fact the doctor's were excellent; I was disgusted with the way my wife's discharge was paid.

The Bangkok hospital is no different from any other private hospital worldwide; their primary function is to make money.
That being said they in my experience do provide first class treatment, but they have absolutely no qualms about sticking to their business orientated policies with no consideration to individual financial circumstances.

I accept that Bangkok Hospital, Hua Hin is a money making machine like any other private hospital. I've no problem whatsoever with the charges made - my wife's health was the priority. The thing that has confused me (and it is very apparent that Dr Mike has not answered on 2 occasions), is why did they go through the motions of dealing with our insurance company's Thai agent for 2 days, wasting everyone's time when they had no intention of letting the insurance company settle the bill?

In my instance, the bill wasn't too much (33K Baht), and my wife had the means with her to settle the bill. However, most holidaymakers take out holiday insurance on the understanding that the insurance company will pay the huge cost when the unthinkable happens. They don't always have the means to pay readily available. What would have happened if my wife never had the means to pay the bill?

Maybe the Bangkok Hospital's policy regarding patients attending the hospital with travel insurance needs to be more transparent.

Surely, the holidaymaker with his/her travel insurance is a key target of the hospital - you should be encouraging them, not antagonising them. Bad news travels fast.

[Dr Mike]

MEDICAL INSURANCE:
I am the first to admit that it can be a mess, and I can absolutly guarantee that it will continue to be so. This week patient came for surgery--the MI had given a guarantee of payment--when the bill was finalised the MI woulds not pay--why, because the patient is Diabetic and there were some charges for the Diabetic care, the MI company know that he is diabetic.
He had to settle the bill and be reimbuesed-another problem is that at 9am here it was 3am in the morning in the UK, so we could not get to talk to anybody with authority.
I am very happy to continue to answer medical questions but MI is NOT my area of expertise.

[Dr Mike]

We are havinga lunch for ladies next wed at noon. over 20 have said they wish to attend. shaould bea nice group and lots of talk---if any other ladies would like to attend--let me know.

[wpcoe]

There is currently a notice at the reception desk saying that direct billing to insurance companies by Bangkok Hospital Hua Hin is not yet in place. The hospital can only issue a "medical certificate" and the patient submits it with an invoice for reimbursement, meaning the patient pays the hospital up front in full regardless of insurance coverage.

The gal working the reception desk assured me that will change "very soon." I assume it is one of the growing pains for a brand new facility.

[Big Boy]

That is very good news - people will not be under any misapprehension - thank you Dr Mike.

[Nereus]

There is currently a notice at the reception desk saying that direct billing to insurance companies by Bangkok Hospital Hua Hin is not yet in place. The hospital can only issue a "medical certificate" and the patient submits it with an invoice for reimbursement, meaning the patient pays the hospital up front in full regardless of insurance coverage.

The gal working the reception desk assured me that will change "very soon." I assume it is one of the growing pains for a brand new facility.

No, what it says is: direct billing for OPD (out patients), is not available yet.

[Big Boy]

[Nereus]

Quite right, Big Boy! I have some more comments to make after I recover from the bill for my recent visit.

[Big Boy]

Thankfully, my insurance company has just paid up after having had their time wasted, and we had to start from scratch again.

[Nereus]

Before anybody jumps on me, let me state that I fully understand the concept of a private hospital especially as it applies to Thailand. I also agree that a facility such as the new Bangkok Hospital Hua Hin is a long needed asset to both Hua Hin, and the surrounding area.

However, despite what many people may believe, and despite the input of Dr. Mike, the new hospital is still a Thai owned and Thai run business, and as such it is always going to follow the “Thai way” of doing things. One of the most obvious of those “Thai ways” is the belief that they are always going to be correct, and that anybody that criticises that concept will cause a loss of face, and therefore should not be considered.

The fact that they are a “service” provider, and as such have an obligation to their paying customers, just does not enter into consideration. This concept appears right across the whole business scene in Thailand, not just hospitals. The big difference with hospitals is that Doctors are held in such high regard in Thailand; therefore nobody has the right to question their position, or actions. Because of this attitude it then follows that anything associated with a hospital is automatically included, be it from the car park attendant to the managing director.

The sad fact of the above is that the more they charge for their services, the more they believe that they are doing their customers a favour. Which is something that you will not see in most of the big Government Hospitals, especially in Bangkok.

…………………………………………………………………………

What follows is an account of my recent visit to Bangkok Hospital Hua Hin.
It is not a complaint, just a statement of facts as they occurred.

I had an ingrown toenail that became infected and obviously needed removing.
I left the visit until the afternoon, as suggested by Dr. Mike.

but if you have had a problem fora few days and any time of day is fine I would suggest that you come in the afternoon.

The car park: Having to regularly use a walking stick because of a hip problem, I tried to park as close to the front entrance as possible. There are only 3 disabled parking bays: one taken up with the hospital Tuk Tuk taxi, one was in use and the other one completely blocked up with half a dozen motor bikes! In addition to not being sufficient disabled bays, the normal bays are that close together that any car bigger than a small Japanese box makes it very difficult to get in and out of a normal car. The obliging attendant was able to direct me into the end bay where I could open the door and get out, but this is ridiculous where you are going to have sick people trying to park! And a lot of the people that can afford the hospital fees are most likely to arrive by private car.


Reception: I include here the front door “staff”.

I managed to hobble across the car park, right past the desk and the ignorant individual sitting behind it outside the door, where I was completely ignored, and up to the reception desk.

Here, Miss Thailand asked what I wanted (she did smile). I told her I needed to see a Doctor as I had a problem with one toe, where upon she left her station and came bounding around to the front of the desk to take a look!!!!
Evidently satisfied that I was not some sort of impostor, she returned to her station where upon I gave her my Bangkok Hospital registration card. Evidently the Hua Hin Bangkok Hospital is not part of the Bangkok group, as the card turned out to be too much for both her and her computer.

This did not happen immediately and in the meantime I am a 67-year-old patient standing there propped up with a walking stick, with my “good” leg objecting because of the pain in my toe. She then put a form down on the desk and told me to fill it in! Never mind that it might be a good idea to get somebody to help me, or sit down somewhere, or sort out what the problem was with my card!

I think it was at this point I decided to leave and told her so. But before I could somebody with a bit more nonce appeared and asked me to go with them. They helped me through to the ER where we passed a gentleman sitting watching the TV, who turned out to be the Doctor. The girls there took my passport and asked me to sit and wait a minute, followed very quickly by into the ER and up on to an operating table.

Treatment in ER: The Doctor in attendance spoke fluent English, immediately informing me that he would need to remove the offending toenail, and proceeded to enquire if I had any known medical conditions, or allergies, that he should know about. While this was happening the attending nurse recorded vital signs and asked a couple of questions.
The removal of the toenail required a local anaesthetic and a wait while it took effect. The procedure was carried out in a totally professional manner, as was the post op dressing. The Doctor informed me that he would like me to return the next morning, both to check the condition, and change the dressing.

I was then assisted to the “cashier” department.



Payment: Now this is where the true colours of the “business” shine through!
After sitting and waiting a couple of minutes I was called to the desk and presented with the bill. This without any reference to drugs or other extras that I might, or might not, need.

Total: 7,072.40 Baht

Being a bit shocked by this amount, and not having that much cash or a credit card with me, I had to draw most of it out of the conveniently located adjacent ATM. I was then asked to wait again, and this time I was called and given the now to be expected bag of pills.

I know now that I should have sat back down when first given the bill and gone through it. But I was by myself, stressed out and just wanted to get home.

The drugs included 14 antibiotic pills, which I refuse to take; each one charged at 89.10 Baht for a total of 1,247.40 Baht, plus 20 Paramed at 2 Baht each.
It also included a charge of 380 Baht for a “suture set”. This may just be a miss-interpreted description, or just another rip off, as the toe did not require any “suture”.

Whatever the case; the thing that really annoys me is the prescribing of antibiotics without any consultation by the Doctor. I should have been asked if I wanted them, or the reason the Doctor considered I needed them. I did not take them and the next morning there was no sign of infection. As the Doctor had requested me to return, that is the time when it should have been decided if I needed antibiotics.

There is HUGE critism of my profession in that we use antibiotics too quickly and too often.
My own children almost never took antibiotics. I took them when I had a hip replacement 9 years ago but before that went over 20 years, antibiotic free.

Follow up visit: The next morning I arrived as requested. Still the same crap in the car park, except that this time there was no end bay vacant and I had to manoeuvre In between two other cars. The attendant was the same helpful fellow as previously. This time I was asked if I needed a wheelchair when I approached the door. I guess that is an improvement, but if I can hobble from the car to the door I hardly need a wheel chair to get inside!

Not much difference at the reception desk. Gave the girl the appointment card that I was issued with the day before and was directed to wait next to the OPD desk.

Now we arrive at a truly “Thai way”!
Who in their right mind could decide to provide those ridiculous seats adjacent to the OPD desk?

Firstly, has anybody tried to sit in them, especially somebody with any injury, or restricted body movement?

Secondly, why are the three rows of them arranged so close together? It is NOT possible for anybody with any restriction to sit in the centre and rear rows, or even get in between the rows for that matter.

Thirdly, what type of deformed person were they designed for? The seat part must be close to one metre depth from the front to the backrest. No normal framed person can possibly sit it them with any degree of comfort.

Lastly, and what is even more bizarre, is the open weave material that they are covered with. Already the arm rests, and the gaps in between the weave of the covering, are filthy dirty with brown stains in evidence. I shudder to think just what type of bacteria may be lurking in there!

Oh, sorry! I am forgetting: they look nice, and that is the most important part! Never mind that they have absolutely no place in a HOSPITAL.

While waiting here I was “accosted” by one of the nurses from the OPD, but as she spoke some strange dialect I had no idea what it was all about, except that she asked if I had “blood pressure”, to which I replied that; yes I did, and that it was rapidly rising! I have since figured out that what she wanted was for me to go with her to the vital signs checking station to measure my blood pressure.

After a short wait I was escorted into see the Doctor and have the dressing changed. The Doctor was happy with his handiwork and no sign of infection, or pain.

I must remark here that it is the first time that I have seen a pair of plastic handled office scissors used in any surgery. Just how do they sterilise them?

Next comes another rort. The previous day I had been given a bag containing a tube of antibiotic cream and a sterile bag containing some type of dressing, which I was told to bring with me to be used to change the dressing.

This I duly did, and the nurse used both the cream and part of the dressing. She also used a small piece of expanding “mesh” and about 2 cm of sticky tape from her supply to hold the dressing in place.

When presented with the bill I find that; in addition to the Doctors fee and nursing fee, I have been charged 219 Baht for “medical supplies”. The total for this 5 minutes of “service”; 769.00 Baht.


My bag of cream and dressing were returned to me and I went through the same procedure again the next morning, except that on this occasion I was charged 208 Baht for “medical supplies”, no Doctors fee, for a total of 358 Baht.

I will add that on this occasion, that after the now expected car park carry on, I was “greeted” inside upon arrival, and taken first to the vital signs station for checking before being asked to wait in those ridiculous chairs.
The first occasion that this has happened.

I have no problem paying a fair price for anything, be it a hospital or any other service. Conversely, I have a big problem when it becomes obvious that I am being ripped off, or that somebody or place, is blatantly assuming that I am that stupid that I will not know.


To summarise this ramble I will add the following comments. These are NOT directed at Dr. Mike, but rather to reinforce my opening remarks.


There has been one respected poster on this thread that has posted a genuine “gripe”, or perhaps more correctly, a genuine criticism based on his recent experience. To my knowledge he has not received a satisfactory answer to date.

Dr. Mike, and with all due respect, you have set yourself up in the firing line
as a contact with your Hospital. In fact, it goes further than that:

Moved to Thai in 04, International Medical Coordinator at Bangkok hospital.

You have further stated that your expertise does not include Medical Insurance, but also go on to state the following:

I give a lecture about Health Insurance and have a problem about getting it inot an hour.

Sorry Sir, if it is not you that feedback should be directed too, perhaps you might inform us who it is?

I believe that a big percentage of local expat residents will use your Hospital regardless of cost considerations, and that is their choice, and probably an extensively researched reason why Bangkok Hospital group decided to build in Hua Hin.

However, that does not give you the right to charge over 200 Baht for a bit of sticky tape, or charge patients for antibiotics that they may not either need, or agree to take.
It also does not give you the right to inconvenience your paying customers by allowing motorbikes to clutter up the inadequate disabled car parking: and countless other examples both in this post, and posted by other members.

Providing an “international” standard of medical care should not be restricted to the
expertise of the Doctors, and their access to modern equipment.

Thank you.

[OscarMike]

The sad fact of the above is that the more they charge for their services, the more they believe that they are doing their customers a favour.

Spot on.

If you don't have insurance and need treatment Bangkok Hospital will escort you to a small room and demand you pay a 100% deposit before undergoing any surgery. If they screw up, no refunds - they are healing you afterall so you should be grateful. Like any big business in Thailand, it is cutthroat, quite literally.

[wpcoe]

I must say, I generally agree about those seats outside the OPD area. I was wondering about the practicality of the open weave design -- how to keep the "inside" clean and sanitary?

Also, I had a bit of a wait today, as my appointment was delayed due to my doctor being called to tend to a patient on an upper floor. That is not a problem, as I understand a doctor can be called to an emergency at any time. What did surprise me was that I was told the delay would be about one hour, and it was almost exactly an hour. I had expected it to be much longer.

I was a bit bored, so I sat and allowed my gaze to roam around the corridor in which the seats are located. If you lean your head back and allow your focus to settle on the ceiling there seem to be lots of holes, cracks and peeling areas for a new structure. Granted, probably not many people lean back and focus on the ceiling like I did.

Also, for what I assume was the intent to make Bangkok Hospital Hua Hin a "first class" facility, I think they went a little cheap on the flooring on the ground floor. It's bog standard pressed-stone stuff like you find in a typical townhouse. What a big, flashy (but granted, more expensive) impression polished granite flooring would make!

Yeah, these are petty snipes, but Nereus started it with the chairs!

OTOH, so far I've been quite impressed with the doctor that Dr.Mike recommended. I had reminded Dr.Mike about my wanting a "primary care" physician to whom I report for any ailment, and let that doctor farm me out to the appropriate specialist, if necessary. We had quite a spirited discussion about the results of my physical from the day before, and she did not seem to be at all offended when I asked her to explain (defend) her recommendations and comments. When all was said and done, I think we respected each other a bit more.

This is probably not a widely held view, but I prefer to have older, more experienced staff. I don't think a single nurse appeared to be older than early 20's. I'm also the odd fellow who prefers airline crew to be the American "senior mamas," who have seen it all, versus young Singapore Girls or ANA robots with fake smiles. There's a lot to be learned in school from books and professors, but there is SO much more to be learned "in the field," and with the entire staff so young, I'm just a little uncomfortable.

[kalbow]

I'm also the odd fellow who prefers airline crew to be the American "senior mamas," who have seen it all, versus young Singapore Girls or ANA robots with fake smiles.

...you mean those "senior mamas" who have seen it all and therefore are so bored that they don't want to offer you that second cup of coffee, and when you ask for a blanket think you've asked to hand over their first-born?

But I understand what you are saying.