Further Tightening of Non Immigrant 'O' Visa

[Rider]

Just to let everyone know the latest update to getting your handy 3 months - 15 month visa.

Prior to this you could just fill out the form and list where you were staying on the main application form.
This could be a hotel, an apartment block etc.

No longer.
I've just learned from the Thai Consulate in Hull, UK that to get one you now have to list and sign the actual address of a friend or member of your family on a separate sheet with your signature stating such (Friends and Family).

There's another one for if you're visiting a pensioner (and we know there's a few on here ) (address and signature AFAIK).

For a volunteer charity there's yet another separate form to fill out, this is a bit more complex as they want more details.

This is NOT for Retirement Visa btw.

I had a strong feeling this was coming though.
Too many people were abusing the system and I feel that a few of the criminals out here that have been thrown in jail (including that murderer down in Phuket) were on Non Immigrant O visa's.
So now this is the result.

Mark my words if they want to take this further the next step will be police reports and interviews to be submitted for visa's, I've gone through this bs for my work overseas and it's not pleasant as you have to travel to an embassy in your home country's capital city, hours waiting etc.

[Super Joe]

to get one you now have to list and sign the actual address of a friend or member of your family on a separate sheet with your signature stating such (Friends and Family).

Mark my words if they want to take this further the next step will be police reports and interviews to be submitted for visa's, I've gone through this bs for my work overseas and it's not pleasant

Before we move onto cavity searches and the like, (I've gone through this with work and it can be quite pleasant), it does appear to be limited to an additional sheet of A4 paper, signed and potentially photocopied (bummer).

The logic behind them requiring the names and addresses of friends of relatives, when applying for an extended stay on the basis of visiting friends & family, could be a bit sinister though. If this was in the current affairs section it would be worthy of a poll

The biggest shake up of Immigration Control since S.A.E.'s were introduced?

SJ

[Rider]

There was another tightening previous to this one where you had to make a declaration you had funds to support you (fair enough).

One more A4 sheet there.

Now with this new one that's another A4 sheet of info. Another way that some immigation dude can grill you over.

I've been recrossing the border from a visa run having the immigration dude want a telephone number so he can call them up to check on who I am. I had to explain to him that I was on the move (I go bike touring a lot).

But what I'm pointing out is that there seems to be a systematic tip-toeing towards a much stricter immigration control on a par with the USA (which believe me, isn't fun at all).

On a side note, you found cavity searches and the like pleasant?! I'm worrying about you SJ...

[usual suspect]

I will be applying for my non O visa at Hull next week..if anything quirky rears its ugly head I'll let you lot know
(wedding certificate & permanent address seems to have worked up to now..lets see eh..??)

[lomuamart]

Married to a Thai and with a permanent address, you'll be fine US.
What people have to remember is that you normally have to be over 50 or married to a Thai to get a Non O visa - single or multiple entry. That's pretty rigorously enforced in neighbouring countries to Thailand now. However, if you apply through a consulate in your home country, they'll be more relaxed about the rules and to visit friends has been a valid reason as far as Hull are concerned. I don't think it's been a valid Imm reason though - at least not recently.
I should think that Hull are just covering themselves as it's common knowledge pretty much everywhere that they're generous with the Non O visas. Hence the self-certification of funds that was introduced a few years ago and now this extra piece of paper. I can't see that they'll actually check that the Thai person named actually knows the applicant.

[moja]

We just enclosed a photo copy of our blue book and Hull was more than happy with that, our passports were back in the usual 48 hours

[uncle tom]

I will be applying for my non O visa at Hull next week..if anything quirky rears its ugly head I'll let you lot know
(wedding certificate & permanent address seems to have worked up to now..lets see eh..??)

I thought I'd check this section of HHAD before putting my own application in - glad I did!

I'll wait till you get your one through now..

Tom

[Rider]

Married to a Thai and with a permanent address, you'll be fine US.
What people have to remember is that you normally have to be over 50 or married to a Thai to get a Non O visa - single or multiple entry. That's pretty rigorously enforced in neighbouring countries to Thailand now. However, if you apply through a consulate in your home country, they'll be more relaxed about the rules and to visit friends has been a valid reason as far as Hull are concerned. I don't think it's been a valid Imm reason though - at least not recently.
I should think that Hull are just covering themselves as it's common knowledge pretty much everywhere that they're generous with the Non O visas. Hence the self-certification of funds that was introduced a few years ago and now this extra piece of paper. I can't see that they'll actually check that the Thai person named actually knows the applicant.

Lou, it is a valid reason to visit friends and family. It's there on black and white on the visa paperwork.

[lomuamart]

Rider,
From Hull (and maybe other consulates in the UK), yes. But the fact remains that "visiting friends" is actually not an officially recognised reason to get a Non O. By official, I mean by Imm law.
This is the main reason why so many apply to Hull and other consulates. They will be more generous in granting Non O's - ie visiting friends. This is not actually a valid reason to be given a Non O as is evidenced by the London Embassy's web site:
http://www.thaiembassyuk.org.uk/newvers ... sa_ni.html
Consulates make a fair bit of money out of visa applications so it's in their interests to be generous. Not so with Embassies who will follow the Thai law more strictly. You won't get a Non O for visiting friends from the Embassy in London any more. You also won't get one on the same basis from even a consulate, let alone an Embassy, in neighbouring countries to Thailand now.
I'm not knocking Hull's generousity. I benefited from it in years gone by before I got married to a Thai and turned 50. All I think is happening with this latest requirement from Hull is that they're covering themselves to a certain extent. They can point out that they have asked for details of the friend if requested to do so by the Thai authorities. After all, they wouldn't want to lose their Non O stamp.
Edit. Here's the requirements from The Ministry of Foreign Affairs. Basically the same as the Embassy:
http://www.mfa.go.th/web/2482.php?id=2489

[Rider]

Lou,

The London Embassy does not mention Friends is an INVALID reason. You are making a negative minded assumption mate.

'Other activities' is what it is granted under. This is what the 'Other' stands for. It's legalise for 'you're a non-immigrant so you can stay, but don't work.'
So this includes friends and family reasons. If this wasn't a valid reason Hull consulate would not be able to grant Non-immigrant O Visa's in the first place.

[lomuamart]

Not negative minded assumption at all, Rider. The MFA website clearly defines what "other" means. There's therefore no reason to list what is not valid.
Hull and other honourary consulates have always been an anomaly when issuing on the basis of visiting friends and Imm have let it go.
I'm not disputing this. I've had multi-entry Non Os from Hull before on the basis of visiting friends. The nearest place to Thailand to get the visa on this basis was Australia and Perth was generally regarded as the most user friendly. However, I believe they're closed now. They were/still are an honourary consulate.
All I'm saying is that I'd never advise anyone to try and get a Non O any more from the London Embassy on the basis of visiting friends. I'll almost guarantee that they'll be refused as they will be at consulates and Embassies in the region of Thailand. These missions stick to the MFA rules. Honourary consulates make a tidy sum from visas and therefore are prone to relax the rules and long may they continue to do so.
It's probably also worth pointing out that Non O visas are designed to be extended annually within Thailand - ad infinitum as long as you qualify. Not surprisingly, the qualifying reasons are exactly the same as the MFA lay down for issuance of the visas - visiting family (need proof of the de facto relationship) and retirement. There are the other couple of reasons as well and finances always also come into play at this stage.
Hull and some other honourary consulates allow the "friends" option. Missions who are directly employed by Thai authorities, such as Embassies and ordinary consulates, do not as they stick to the MFA regulations.
The moral of the story? If you want a Non O on the basis of visiting friends, find yourself an honourary consulate. That's where you'll stand the best chance of getting it.

[PET]

Very well said lomuamart you have made what was getting complicated quite simple to comprehend.

[Rider]

Not negative minded assumption at all, Rider. The MFA website clearly defines what "other" means. There's therefore no reason to list what is not valid.
Hull and other honourary consulates have always been an anomaly when issuing on the basis of visiting friends and Imm have let it go.
I'm not disputing this. I've had multi-entry Non Os from Hull before on the basis of visiting friends. The nearest place to Thailand to get the visa on this basis was Australia and Perth was generally regarded as the most user friendly. However, I believe they're closed now. They were/still are an honourary consulate.
All I'm saying is that I'd never advise anyone to try and get a Non O any more from the London Embassy on the basis of visiting friends. I'll almost guarantee that they'll be refused as they will be at consulates and Embassies in the region of Thailand. These missions stick to the MFA rules. Honourary consulates make a tidy sum from visas and therefore are prone to relax the rules and long may they continue to do so.
It's probably also worth pointing out that Non O visas are designed to be extended annually within Thailand - ad infinitum as long as you qualify. Not surprisingly, the qualifying reasons are exactly the same as the MFA lay down for issuance of the visas - visiting family (need proof of the de facto relationship) and retirement. There are the other couple of reasons as well and finances always also come into play at this stage.
Hull and some other honourary consulates allow the "friends" option. Missions who are directly employed by Thai authorities, such as Embassies and ordinary consulates, do not as they stick to the MFA regulations.
The moral of the story? If you want a Non O on the basis of visiting friends, find yourself an honourary consulate. That's where you'll stand the best chance of getting it.

I'm not doubting that Lou, but you can get Non Immigrant O (FF) visa from London just as you can from Hull?

Hull is staffed by Thais just as their London Embassy is too.

Why London is maybe negative on granting them is probably down to the personality's there?
Has anyone here been refused Non immigrant O (FF) visa from London Thai Embassy?

[lomuamart]

I'm happy to stand corrected if anyone's got a Non O for visiting friends from the London Embassy lately. My understanding is that they won't issue for this reason.
I thought Hull was staffed by Brits? It's just a shipping agent (as honourary consulates often are). The consul is certainly a Brit (Alan Taylor) and I think he's got one lady helper who's a Brit as well. That's certainly how it was in the past. Maybe they've expanded and taken on a Thai speaker?

[Rider]

The lady speaker I spoke to was a few years ago (2007 I think).