Just When We Thought The Pound Was Recovering

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PET
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Post by PET »

Big Boy wrote: Whilst I also sympathise with those who are struggling (and HHF), I think they also have to take an element of the blame. They have done their planning based on a strong pound or dollar. If they had prepared properly, they would have looked at trends, and maybe just noticed that the Baht has dropped to around the 30 Baht to the Pound within the last 20 years. What goes up, usually comes down.
Do you honestly think that one should look back 20 years, see what has happened and on that basis believe it will happen again, and react/invest accordingly for the future so many years? Blimey!!

Hindsight is 20/20 vision as they say and thats all that can be said about such a statement.

Countries in this area of the world want strong currencies to make maximum revenue from their exports ( Thailand -Rice)
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Post by sandman67 »

its them damn owls.... they think its a hoot.

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Post by Big Boy »

PET wrote:
Big Boy wrote: Whilst I also sympathise with those who are struggling (and HHF), I think they also have to take an element of the blame. They have done their planning based on a strong pound or dollar. If they had prepared properly, they would have looked at trends, and maybe just noticed that the Baht has dropped to around the 30 Baht to the Pound within the last 20 years. What goes up, usually comes down.
Do you honestly think that one should look back 20 years, see what has happened and on that basis believe it will happen again, and react/invest accordingly for the future so many years? Blimey!!

Hindsight is 20/20 vision as they say and thats all that can be said about such a statement.

Countries in this area of the world want strong currencies to make maximum revenue from their exports ( Thailand -Rice)
Honestly? Yes I do. If people want to stick their heads in the sand and ignore the bad times, then they shouldn't complain if the bad times come back and bite them on the arse.

20 years is not a long time in this world.

Out of interest PET, what period do you think people should be undertaking such an analysis over? It's only 12 years since the Baht achieved over 50 Baht status. Before that, we used to budget on 40 Baht to the Pound, and hope it would be higher rather than lower.
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Post by PET »

Firstly we are looking presently at a unique situation, and have been for the last 12 months. There were of course danger signals from 2006 and those who took action were clever- but few did.

So to ask now how long one would look back is not relevant to your original 20 years because the situation now is totally different.- in fact unique as I said before.

I personally would merely glance back but seriously look at the present and the immediate future, but one cannot predict long term.

However suggesting that what goes round comes round has absolutely no financial justification - unless you know something nobody else does ?
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Post by Big Boy »

I assume that we are talking a move to LOS for the rest of one's life. If you are moving at age 50, and don't intend dying until at least 75, you will be looking 25 years forward. Therefore, wouldn't it be wise to look at a similar period retrospectively?

In my example, you would see 12 years mostly at 50 Baht or above and 13 years averaging 40 Baht or less. So, you want to retire - you ignore the longer period because it doesn't suit your income - that could be likened to buying a house without help from a solicitor or having a structural survey done. Absolute madness.

Having said my piece, I honestly do sympathise with these people because the thought of living out your last years in paradise must make you see what you want to see, and the risk factor, no matter how low will always happen to somebody else :? ........... won't it?
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Post by Wanderlust »

Big Boy,
While I agree with your concept of learning from the past and preparing for good and bad times, I don't agree that you could have predicted the current situation if, as I did, you moved here 10 years ago, or even 3 years ago; all you could say is that at some point in the future things are likely to change. Given that a couple of years prior to my arrival in Thailand the pound/baht rate had been at 90, I think it could have been reasonable to assume that the rate of 60 when I arrived was actually a bad time for the pound; I didn't make that assumption but I certainly never envisaged the banks making such a monumental cock up of the western world's economy either. I still think this will still only be a blip, if rather a long one, and that at some point in the next year the baht will weaken and the pound get stronger and I really don't believe it will ever hit the low you are referring to from the past. I don't think having such a strong currency is any help to Thailand at all because as well as making their exports more expensive, it also causes companies to defer or even cancel planned moves to the country, such as manufacturing or assembly operations, because the set up becomes more expensive. Any country whose currency is too strong suffers more unemployment and unused capacity and deflation unless they are completely insular, although the possible upside is that imports become cheaper.
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Post by sargeant »

it doesnt help when the governor of the bank of england calls for a weaker pound
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Post by norm »

sargeant wrote:it doesnt help when the governor of the bank of england calls for a weaker pound
If you are a politician and a event you don't know how to control happens, the best thing you can do as say that is the way we want it, and planned it because it is good for you.

So the average person thinks oh good he is doing it for our benefit what a nice guy. You may end up in much deeper sh-it further downstream but for now he looks good and that is all that counts. What happens downstream is someone else's problem.

Obama is also saying they want a weaker dollar. Same problem same answer.
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Post by Super Joe »

PET wrote:So to ask now how long one would look back is not relevant to your original 20 years because the situation now is totally different.- in fact unique as I said before.
The situation with regard to the property boom here a few years back was unique too, resulting in massive hikes in town centre rents, but it was only yesterday you were criticising bar owners for 'bad financial planning'.

Agree with BB, anyone moving out here post-1997 and not planning against how vulnerable Asian currencies are during financial crisis, like myself, only have ourselves to blame. It don't help us none spewing at Wall Street and Europes equivalents.

Like BB I do have genuine sympathy, its affecting me and friends too. It'll be over in a year or so anyway until the next one, so ke sera sera, we're going to Wembley and all that.

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Post by sargeant »

Absolutely norm slippery little suckers aint they :roll: :roll:

Change of thread title to "Just when we thought the pound was going past the u bend"

Just got 54.25 to the quid 20 mins ago lol :D
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Post by Big Boy »

Wanderlust wrote:Big Boy,
While I agree with your concept of learning from the past and preparing for good and bad times, I don't agree that you could have predicted the current situation if, as I did, you moved here 10 years ago, or even 3 years ago; all you could say is that at some point in the future things are likely to change. Given that a couple of years prior to my arrival in Thailand the pound/baht rate had been at 90, I think it could have been reasonable to assume that the rate of 60 when I arrived was actually a bad time for the pound; I didn't make that assumption but I certainly never envisaged the banks making such a monumental cock up of the western world's economy either. I still think this will still only be a blip, if rather a long one, and that at some point in the next year the baht will weaken and the pound get stronger and I really don't believe it will ever hit the low you are referring to from the past. I don't think having such a strong currency is any help to Thailand at all because as well as making their exports more expensive, it also causes companies to defer or even cancel planned moves to the country, such as manufacturing or assembly operations, because the set up becomes more expensive. Any country whose currency is too strong suffers more unemployment and unused capacity and deflation unless they are completely insular, although the possible upside is that imports become cheaper.
Don't get me wrong, if I had been granted my early retirement when I requested it, I'd have been planning on 70 Baht to the Pound as well, because it's what I wanted to believe.

However, I would have been very foolish. All that I'm saying is if you're planning to move somewhere for at least X number of years, you should take retrospective currency fluctuations in to account for a similar period (yes, very easy in hindsight).

If you only look at recent 'boom' times, you are almost certainly going to come a cropper. Boom times usually come to an end, and to me, anything over 40 Baht to the Pound is boom time.

As for the bits about, "I don't think having such a strong currency is any help to Thailand at all because as well as making their exports more expensive, it also causes companies to defer or even cancel planned moves to the country, such as manufacturing or assembly operations, because the set up becomes more expensive. Any country whose currency is too strong suffers more unemployment and unused capacity and deflation unless they are completely insular, although the possible upside is that imports become cheaper," statement, I'm sorry, but :blabla: I've been reading that for years on this Forum. I used believe that it made common sense once, and used to preach that it had to happen. Unfortunately TIT, and I no longer believe there is any desire to weaken the Baht.
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Post by hhfarang »

The other factor is that at the same time the currency exchange has gone against us (Americans and Brits), imo the cost of living (because of the aforementioned boom, I guess) has increased in Hua Hin over the past five years.

Nothing is going our way. It's like the perfect financial storm... :shock:
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Post by PeteC »

hhfarang wrote:The other factor is that at the same time the currency exchange has gone against us (Americans and Brits), imo the cost of living (because of the aforementioned boom, I guess) has increased in Hua Hin over the past five years.

Nothing is going our way. It's like the perfect financial storm... :shock:
I pretty much believe the government published inflation figures here. However, I believe they're calculated from a basket of items normal Thais buy, fuel and imported goods not included.

If you drive a lot, eat out at tourist restaurants, splurge at Villa for imported items etc., for sure I've seen costs go up dramatically over the past years. My little trips to Pattaya to stock up on food goodies to last a month used to be around 8,000 baht a few years ago. Same items/quantity now it's closer to 11. In the 90's I was paying 8.5 for a liter of diesel, around 28 now I think, I don't like to look when filling up. :shock:

I know it's easier to say 'live like a Thai' then actually do it, and it's useless if you don't enjoy that lifestyle. However, it is key in keeping one's costs down here. Pete :cheers:
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Post by STEVE G »

HH makes a good point as inflation is more dangerous to long term plans than currency fluctuations that will tend to average out over the years.
This is why I intend to keep working as long as I possibly can as I can't see a way to fund a retirement at the prices that are likely to exist in 30 years time.
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Post by JimmyGreaves »

STEVE G wrote:HH makes a good point as inflation is more dangerous to long term plans than currency fluctuations that will tend to average out over the years.
This is why I intend to keep working as long as I possibly can as I can't see a way to fund a retirement at the prices that are likely to exist in 30 years time.
Waiting for the golden moment is also a huge risk as it may never come.

Yes that huge dip in the pound a week or so ago has now reversed itself in a few days. Let's hope the calls for a weaker pound was a bluff :D
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