Another crackdown on border runners

[Khundon1975]

Buksida

HSBC's Regular Saver pays 10% fixed for 1 year if you save £25-£250 a month but only if you pay your salary or pension into an HSBC current account. If you are in UK ring 0800 032 4729 and they will explain.

Hope that helps.

[Super Joe]

Hi SJ, Just a quick question about PR. If you buy PR for 100k does that then allow you to own land in your own name? Cheers, Dave

Hi Dave, no unfortunately not can't see that one ever happening, it's real purpose and advantages as I see it are regarding immigration for long stayers.
It removes the requirement of needing a visa, annual extensions and 90 day reporting, you just need to do the re-entry permits when going overseas. It takes away the need to show any income or have any 'show money' in a Thai bank, you can withdraw your 800,000 Baht and use it as you wish.
It could prove to be of real importance to someone in the future who can no longer meet the financial requirements for their extension or people who need to use their 'show money' for emergencies.

There are some other benefits PR gives such as entry to the government medical plan covering hospital treatment from the age of 60, borrowing from Thai Banks to purchase property/vehicles, automatic extensions to your work permit applications, and numerous other things that are more minor, there's a couple of threads on here covering PR. Basically it can be important for some and not worth it for others.

SJ

[margaretcarnes]

Hi Caller - yes I'm afraid the info is correct - must admit though I don't know what criteria immigrants need to satisfy for such perks.
Interesting how grants for cars might be in effect doubled as well, now the government has introduced the 2000 pounds scrappage scheme!

The Muslim population of Netherlands/Denmark was mentioned earlier. (I think it must be Netherlands.) Which really rings bells with me. Not, I hope, because of racism or any religious phobias. Some of the UKs most successful immigrants are Jewish, Chinese, and Indian after all.
But I'm noticing more and more western women in purdah - presumably because they have married into the muslim faith. Fair enough.
Am I alone though in finding this a bit threatening? (And is 'purdah' the right word for muslim womens' clothes anyway?)
While I'm all for mixed marriages I just can't identify exactly what causes this sense of unease when seeing a Western woman covered head to foot in the black robes. Maybe it's to do with the image of subservience portrayed. Maybe it's the message it sends out 'don't mess with me or I'll have you in court for descrimination'....
Sorry - off topic!

[Khundon1975]

SJ
I haven't replied to your last post to me regarding the 800K rule for a few days, as I was waiting for the posters who, you say, I have been sneering at, to either post on the forum or PM me with their concerns and if I have upset them in any way I would have given them an unreserved apology.
As of this evening, none of them seem to feel the need to post or pm me on the subject.

You, however have chosen to post on 4 lines in 4 of my posts and taken them totally out of context. That's a trick the gutter press use to try con the readers of their rags.

Come on SJ surely you are better than that!
Lets put them back where they belong shall we, with a little note of explanation, just for you.

Jims post to me.
You are having a giraffe mate. Anyone who thinks 10% is easy is either a) a genius or b) about to get masses of egg on face.
Enjoy the weekend

My reply to Jim.
You live in your little World mate, I have been achieving those sort of returns for years on stocks & shares and much higher returns on property in UK & Europe. Of course to achieve those sort of returns on property in Thailand at the moment, is not so easy but can be done if you don't buy crap and try to sell it as premium property, as many people have been trying to do. I am not really concerned if you can't. Stick with 0.5% from your bank and enjoy your life.

I considered Jim's post to be slightly condescending and that is why I started my reply with,
“You live in your little World” I added the word “mate” to lighten the tone of my reply, the rest of the post (as in all previous posts to him) was both civil and factual.
As to the last line regarding the word “concerned” well, that is an adjective meaning affected, interested, involved, agitated, distressed, uneasy, unsettled, etc.

I have no doubt that Jim is a nice fellow but as I have never met him and he is neither family or what I could call a friend, why should I feel any of the descriptions above, for him? To say (falsely) that I was concerned, in my post to him, would mean nothing to either of us.
However, I was not upset at his post, if I had been, I would have made that very plain in my reply to him.

Johnnyk post to me.
But khundon, aren't you drawing down the 800K month-by-month as you would anywhere?
Right now I don't know where 10% can be gotten. Let me know please!
If 10% can be gotten it will not be without serious risk IMO and anything in the 3-5% range
wouldn't be easily accessed for monthly living expenses

My reply to Johnnyk
“Of course it can be used month by month and another 800k transferred each year (at a cost).
The money though is tied up for 3 months at no interest to me.
I can earn over 10% interest by investing in stocks/shares property etc. in UK /Europe at the moment. It's not rocket science."

The first 3 lines of my reply are simple facts, as to the final 4 words, I say this to you.
This term is used in everyday language and is in no way derogatory. Expressions like these are useful short hand, and serve the same purpose as “blocks” of words do in speed-reading, you can discern the meaning without having to use a couple of paragraphs to get there.
I did not use it (nor would I ever use it) to infer that my knowledge of a subject is superior to an other's.
I used it in my reply to Johnnyk, as a shortened way of saying, with some research and of course a little risk, (then going on to list and explore the many ways he could make his money work better for him), after all isn't' that what most people would want?

Johnnyk post to me.
Not wanting to be rude, but I've never understood the anxiety about putting 800K baht in a Thai bank in order to live in Thailand.
Its money to live on.
Most countries worth living in require something in the way of guaranteed funds so they don't have to foot the bill for non-citizens.
Yes, bank interest is lost.
But these days how much are banks paying on 800K baht/$25K/15K sterling?
2% maybe.

My reply to Johnnyk.
That's OK mate, it's not rude.
Anyone who is leaving money in a British bank is only getting 0.5% interest, if you allow for inflation, they are losing money on the deal.
I'm not anxious about putting 800K in a Thai bank, we have several times that there already, put there in 2001/2002, so that my wife can continue to purchase land and property there, whilst she is in UK.
I would not consider doing that now, with the exchange rate.
My point about leaving money in Thai banks at no interest, is that I can earn over 10% interest by investing in stocks/shares property in UK/Europe at the moment, I'm not able to do that in Thailand.
Why let it lose money in a Thai bank when it can be earning money which can then be spent in Thailand.

Again, a statement of fact, I fail to see why you have taken this line out of context!
Perhaps you feel that anyone lucky enough to have transferred money to Thailand when the exchange rate was very good, has somehow done something wrong.
Many, many ex pats did just that and in many discussions on this and other forums are happy to post of their experiences and good fortune. I don't think it is something that should be open to criticism by anyone, least of all you.
I sent money last year to Thailand and got 44Baht to the GBP, a poor exchange rate I think you will agree.
I have no problem with getting such a poor rate, of course I would have preferred to get more but that's life.
Now lets get and move on to your last two posts to me shall we.

SJ
KD wrote in reply to Johnnyk.
“Of course it can be used month by month and another 800k transferred each year (at a cost). The money though is tied up for 3 months at no interest to me”

SJ wrote
Based on your above post regarding you raking it in at 10%, why would losing a few months interest on a relatively small amount (to you), the 800k be of much concern ?

And just the mention of the TT transfer fee of 25 quid, or whatever it is, done it for me.

KD wrote
SJ, It is very easy for you to sneer about me, or anyone else being concerned what happens to their money.

SJ wrote.
KD75, I wasn't sneering at you regarding the transfer costs at all, the opposite infact. You had been sneering at other posters in our 'little worlds' as we do not find it easy to achieve such high investment returns as you. I was making the ironic point that why should you worry about the 25 pound TT costs in your world, it's only in our little world's that it become relevant.

KD1975
Where do I say or infer, that 800k is a small amount??
It was you who said that, don't presume to know what I think about 800k please, stick to facts.

Money, is a business tool, nothing more, nothing less, and I am glad I don't take a cavalier attitude to the costs associated with it's use.

I have been in business all my life, both for myself and for large multinational companies and I am used to controlling costs.
Transfer fees and loss of profit on capital investments, are just that, costs. Just like staff wages, company vehicles, office overheads, business rates etc.

The issue was the 800k and the loss of profits whilst it languished in a Thai bank and the costs of transfers into Thailand and then the costs of transferring it out again.

As I have mentioned in another post, 800k invested for a year in HSBC account pays 10% interest for the year, if it was in the fund I mentioned in a previous post it would make 47% interest.
800k @55Baht to £1 = £14,545 @ 10% interest = £1,454 x 55 = 79,970 Baht. Plus transfer costs of approx 3,300, makes a total loss of 83,270Baht.
800k @ 55Baht to £1 = £14,545 @ 47% interest = £6,836 x 55 = 375,980 Baht plus transfer costs of approx 3,300, makes a total loss of 379,280 Baht.
Do you get it now? Does it still do it for you?
Either scenario is bad news and I think even you would agree with that.


You then made the following post to me
SJ
"Well I won't call you those things then , just can't understand myself why people choose to live/spend long periods of time in a far away country, that they know will be massively different to their own as it's a 'developing 3rd World country' (or whatever) without, it seems, being bothered to research what to expect.
They get here and it's all shock, horror, there's a lot of corruption here, wish the travel agent had told me.

And we all know full well these constant changes/closing of loopholes with the border runs are, being generous, at least in part due to us Foreigners abusing the system by being 'tourists' for last 12 years"[/b]

Do you really imagine SJ that I did not do my homework on Thailand and just stuck a pin in a map and thought, I'll retire and invest money there?

Of course I didn't and cannot imagine any fool doing that.

I was given a brain and I use it, just because I decide to come to Thailand, does not mean that I give up the right to think for myself, I question the rules and would like to see changes, where is the problem in that?

Having 800k in a Thai bank for 3 months to get a visa is, to me, as useless as Anne Franks drum kit, when it could be invested in other things, either in Thailand or elsewhere.

The requirement does not prove the money is mine (I could have borrowed it from a friend, as I understand many did in the past to get their visa), I can take the money out of the bank after getting my visa and have no intention of spending most of it in Thailand, but instead I could live off a few baht a day and bum around like many do.

The show money rule is stupid, there is no check carried out on where the money came from, or what I will do with the money after I get my visa.

With respect SJ, you post some good useful advice on this forum but please allow me to criticize the rules without making posts which, I believe are designed to put me off doing just that.

Thailand is not my country but it is my wife's and anything that affects me, affects her.
Thousands of expats agree that some of the visa rules are, in some cases draconian, badly written, open to abuse and corruption and need changing.
We have a right to question any rules that affect us and not just sit back and take what ever is thrown our way without any one deriding us for doing it.

If enough people discuss and post on the issues, then maybe change may come.

[Super Joe]

Sorry KD75 but I've never read such a long winded over-reaction, I stopped about 3/4 of the way down to be honest. You said what you said about people in their 'little worlds' etc and I reacted and said what I said.
Honestly not interested in reading it again or responding point by point, we'll agree to disagree.

Cheers

SJ

[Khundon1975]

Sorry KD75 but I've never read such a long winded over-reaction, I stopped about 3/4 of the way down to be honest. You said what you said about people in their 'little worlds' etc and I reacted and said what I said.
Honestly not interested in reading it again or responding point by point, we'll agree to disagree.

Cheers

SJ

Where have I seen that before?

OK SJ agree to disagree.

[dtaai-maai]

Well, I read it all. I can tell you I thoroughly enjoyed:

...as useless as Anne Franks drum kit...

[Khundon1975]

Well, I read it all. I can tell you I thoroughly enjoyed:

...as useless as Anne Franks drum kit...

dtaai-maai

That is always the point in posting, isn't it.

Glad you had a laugh at that line DM.

[Super Joe]

Just had another look at your post re: the amount of interest lost etc by the 800k rule and presume thats where you misread my comment, and it also re-inforces what I mentioned. I never once said there wasn't interest to be lost I only sneered (as you called it) about you being concerned about the bank transfer fees when you can make such high returns via the interest. This 'sneer' was only in response to your comment about those of us living in our 'little world's' because we are not as fortunate as you in finding it easy to achieve 10% returns.

Major over-reaction mate.

SJ

[Khundon1975]

Sorry KD75 but I've never read such a long winded over-reaction, I stopped about 3/4 of the way down to be honest. You said what you said about people in their 'little worlds' etc and I reacted and said what I said.
Honestly not interested in reading it again or responding point by point, we'll agree to disagree.

Cheers

SJ

SJ

After this post to me, we agreed to disagree, now you have decided to pick out one point in your argument and continue, without covering any of the other points raised.

With respect SJ, I'm not interested after you posted the above dismissive reply.

Let the forum readers make of it what they will, I've finished with the subject.

No disrespect intended SJ.

[chopsticks]

Khundon's calculations are wrong as the HSBC saver account only pays the high rate of interest on a maximum of £250 pm paid in monthly over the one year - so only the first £1500 or less pa when averaged out -would earn the high interest rate - anything over this amount the usual low interest rate applies. £1500 is about 10% of the 800 000 Baht he used in his interest comparison.

[Khundon1975]

Khundon's calculations are wrong as the HSBC saver account only pays the high rate of interest on a maximum of £250 pm paid in monthly over the one year - so only the first £1500 or less pa when averaged out -would earn the high interest rate - anything over this amount the usual low interest rate applies. £1500 is about 10% of the 800 000 Baht he used in his interest comparison.

chopsticks

That's interesting chopsticks, thanks for that.

Seems that they may be paying me too much, though the rate I posted was what the bank told me and has been paying.

Seems like a trip to the bank is on the cards and a little bit of required.

I'll tell you one thing, they ain't getting it back.

At least the second calculation was correct.

[Khundon1975]

chopsticks

Just phoned them, surprised I got an answer this time of night.

Sad to say you are correct, they have been paying me interest @ 10% on a direct debit I set up for £1,250 per month when opening the account in the branch office.

Apparently no one picked up on it, not even the chap who opened the account for me and the computer (it's always the computer) just churned it out.

Ho hum, have to move it now.

Apologies to the forum for the mistake.

[chopsticks]

As they say the devil is in the detail.
After you've earned about £150 annual interest on the allowed maximum of £250 deposited each month, then the interest on any remaining balance drops to a paltry 0.5 to 1.0% as Buksida illustrated.
In reality you will not find any UK bank offering more than about 4% on
normal savings accounts.
The return on equities and property can seem higher but it all depends on where you choose the starting point for your calculations as I'm sure you already know

[Khundon1975]

chopsticks

Yes it always is, just had a look at a photo copy of my form from my files, think the problem was the amount on DD 1250, that managed to fool the computer and the bank clerk Seems they didn't take the subscription charge either.

Still, have to pop in tomorrow and sort it out but they still ain't getting it back.

Agree, property,funds and equities are a lot easier, I understand those. Bloody banks, but we can't do without them.

Sorry Mods this is