Thai law and legal fatherhood of children outside wedlock

[buksida]

You learn something new everyday - or so the saying goes. Anyway this all came about as I needed to make a Thai Will which is a lot more complex than a Western one if it is to hold up in court. The list of paperwork to make this official was long and included passport copies of the executors, ID cards of those in it, marriage certificates, birth certificates and a little known document called a "bai rup rong bot" (ใบรับรองบุตร).

This apparently was needed because our eldest son was born a couple of weeks before our marriage paperwork was completed so officially I have no legal rights as a father. The document is not necessary for children born inside of official Thai wedlock (the dates on your marriage cert).

The lawyer said getting it was easy but not many parents know about it, just pop along to the local amphur office, all you need is an official translation of your passport, mothers ID, marriage cert and child's birth cert.

Amphur visit this morning and of course we hit a wall straight away when the officer without blinking says I need paperwork from my embassy certifying who I am. "Speak to my lawyers" I ask him (always wanted to say that), after ten minutes of back and forth he agrees that the certified passport translation is enough, but now we need two independent witnesses and it cannot be done on this day because he is busy.

A three storey building home to hundreds of government workers but apparently only this one dude can do it. Lets make an appointment then ... its in a months time, apparently this chappy is very busy ... either that or he needs the time to find his face again after being proved wrong by Thai lawyers that actually know the law.

Has anyone any experience with this new document? Could it be what is required for this latest father-child support visa clampdown? It was news to me, any enlightenment on the subject is welcome.

Reminds me of a saying an old friend once told me: "Thailand is a rusty bureaucratic tanker that floats on an ocean of paperwork."

[Frog]

SO why do you men choose to live in Thailand if you look down on it soo much?

[buksida]

Stupid comments like that do not help anyone, I'm simply asking for more information on the bureaucracy in question and commenting on the fact that 'officials' in Thailand purposefully make life difficult for people when there really is no need.

Stay off threads if you have nothing constructive to contribute, this information may help others who are also unaware of their legal situations with regards to their biological offspring in Thailand.

[Frog]

I apologize if your feelings were hurt and I was the only one who responded to your post. Me I am also trying to change the system as well but in a much more constructive way which does not condemn an entire nation or government "as a tanker floating on an ocean of paperwork" , atleast Thailand didn't spill into the ocean like British Petroleum did last year. I'm actually helping the government here to CLEAN the ocean when I'm not sick and bedridden. I hope you become a wiser man tomorrow sir..

[Spitfire]

I agree with Bukisda, genuine question that you put your experience into and all you get is a smart arse answer from a deluded troll.

Buksida, agree, sounds like a mare and I didn't know about it either, new to me. It couldn't possibily be easy on this front and I personally would have gone into it at the office with a pessimistic stance to start with as they enjoy making things difficult for us.

Even someone like you who has been here for a long time they just give you sort shift.

As for the prat that posted above...........are you going out of your way to annoy people?

'Trolls r Us' are alive and well by the look of it.

Pity there isn't a voting system on the forum about banning people like you Frog....democracy in action etc.

[Frog]

[Post deleted: this topic has nothing to do with Royalty - if you disrupt another topic or break the boards rules again you will be banned.]

[Spitfire]

Whatever dude.....

[Takiap]

Frog.............if you don't mind me asking, how long have you lived here in Thailand?

[dtaai-maai]

This Frog feller must be laughing up his little green sleeve. He's got the entire forum hopping mad!!

Richard made sense (it had to happen eventually ) when he said "ignore him and he'll go away".

[margaretcarnes]

Buksi - just a thought. Would it be easier to go for legal adoption of the lad? I know it sounds bizarre and shouldn't be necessary, but maybe? And while that is all going on would it be worth getting DNA done as well?
We all know what a minefield Thai law is, particularly regarding parental rights and inheritance laws. If you were back home it would be enough that your name was down on the birth certificate as the father. Clearly that isn't going to be enough in the LOS, so I think you need to play along and hedge your bets.

[buksida]

Thanks for bringing this back on topic Mags, yes in the west things are far simpler and none of this would be necessary for biological parents, Buddha only knows why there are so many hurdles here.

Adoption shouldn't be necessary and isn't really the issue, I'd have to do it with both kids, it would cost tens of thousands, incur mountains of paperwork, and waste no end of time in courts with lawyers. This seems to be the only option for divorcees wanting a visa since the latest crack-down, I'm still happily married ... (I think )!

I'll update when I get this magic document from the amphur next month as it seems I'm the first one on here that has come across it! Maybe this alone will suffice legally in which case I'll post the procedure and requirements so that it may help others.



... swimming in the ocean of paperwork.

[Nereus]

Buksida, I can`t help with your question but I hope that it works out for you.
Could you PM me the name of your Lawyer, as I run off the one I was using. Thanks very much.

[PeteC]

I scratch my head at all this if the child was born under his/her Father's surname and has that Thai birth certificate name, Thai passport, foreign passport name etc. Pete

[buksida]

I scratch my head at all this

You're not the only one, the little dude has my surname, a Thai and UK passport, Thai and UK birth certificate and a Thai ID card - yet the wheels of Thai bureaucracy still turn against us ...

[lomuamart]

Do you know whether this procrastination is a recent development? Only, I'm wondering whether it might, in some way, be tied in with the new regulations regarding getting annual extensions on the back of supporting a Thai child?
Something Mags said about a DNA test and so on prodded my memory.
Obviously, it shouldn't be necessary, but maybe something to bear in mind?